[Tye]

So I’m curious if this has been addressed anywhere. Are these batteries married to the Mach E or could there be a program to buy a better battery when technology allows in say 4-5 years? I am aware through software updates they can make more of the current battery juice available. I’m thinking about 70-100mil gains though. Thoughts?

My main anxiety with paying 60k+ on a car this advanced is just knowing the tech will improve so much. I think I can live with my purchase if I know that I can improve it later on.

 

[Ajmartineau]

It’s not very likely that this will be an option.

 

[ArtyMachy]

Most likely not Ford. Maybe 3rd party. I know a garage near me that retrofits a bigger battery for a Nissan Leaf. But to be honest, I think it is just your range anxiety making you think that you will need a bigger battery. Come on, for every day drives even the standard 200 mile one is plenty.

 

[Jhalkias]

Somewhere, someone posted an online video that was for Ford service departments. With the right equipment, the battery is easily removable and replaceable. Ford is trying also to standardize the pack platform for vehicles. The question is will Ford itself make upgrades and not just repairs available.

 

[MachDrive]

Although technically it probably could be done, it could get costly.

If its just the battery packs and everything else stays the same, it would still be north of $15,000 at today’s prices. Unless batteries become crazy-cheap in 4-5 years.

If they have to change the charging speed capability, it would be even greater. Basically, replacing everything from the charge-port through the batteries, power regulators, electric cabling, etc. it would be like building a new car.

 

[ChasingCoral]

So I’m curious if this has been addressed anywhere. Are these batteries married to the Mach E or could there be a program to buy a better battery when technology allows in say 4-5 years? I am aware through software updates they can make more of the current battery juice available. I’m thinking about 70-100mil gains though. Thoughts?

My main anxiety with paying 60k+ on a car this advanced is just knowing the tech will improve so much. I think I can live with my purchase if I know that I can improve it later on.

Did you buy a SR or an ER battery? Are you already a BEV driver? If you went ER, you've handled lots of future-proofing.

When was the last time you drove more than 200 miles without stopping for a break? 300 miles? The biggest issues are sufficient charging stations (improving daily) and faster charging (may be an OTA upgrade). Ford hinted that the hardware in the MME is capable of charging faster than 150 kW, so they may upgrade the charging curves.

 

[Diogenes]

This is the Ford Warranty on the Battery:

Electric Vehicle Component Coverage: 8 years or 100,00 miles (whichever occurs first), with retention of 70% or more of the original High Voltage Battery capacity over that period.

So the worst case range for our Premium AWD ER battery after 8 years before the warranty kicks in is 189 Miles. Anyone purchasing a MME needs to be comfortable with this or go with the hybrid Ford Options program.

In reality the Ford reliability engineers are probably very confident that they will replace only a tiny fraction of batteries under warranty. I also suspect that they're taking into account that batteries will get more denser and cheaper so potentially, they'll have to replace only portions of the battery pack.

For us though, a multi vehicle family... an 8 year old car with 100K miles on it will most likely be relegated to local, in town duty. So not a big deal... although we're still leaning towards leasing vs purchasing.

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

Did you buy a SR or an ER battery? Are you already a BEV driver? If you went ER, you've handled lots of future-proofing.

When was the last time you drove more than 200 miles without stopping for a break? 300 miles? The biggest issues are sufficient charging stations (improving daily) and faster charging (may be an OTA upgrade). Ford hinted that the hardware in the MME is capable of charging faster than 150 kW, so they may upgrade the charging curves.

When I was considering switching dealers to a mainland dealer I started wondering how I was going to get the Mach E from Central Oregon (where we have investment property) to Oakland for shipment to Hawaii. I started looking at EA (primarily) and found DC fast charge stations all along I-5, usually every 70 miles or so. Recharging and range is quickly become a non-issue during longer road trips. The real issue is how you're going to occupy your time at the 17 Walmart and Target stops you make while waiting on 80% or so.

 

[Summerlin Bob]

When I was considering switching dealers to a mainland dealer I started wondering how I was going to get the Mach E from Central Oregon (where we have investment property) to Oakland for shipment to Hawaii. I started looking at EA (primarily) and found DC fast charge stations all along I-5, usually every 70 miles or so. Recharging and range is quickly become a non-issue during longer road trips. The real issue is how you're going to occupy your time at the 17 Walmart and Target stops you make while waiting on 80% or so.

Having seen many of The People of Walmart videos, if you like to people watch you may never get back to the trip

 

[St00k]

Most likely not Ford. Maybe 3rd party. I know a garage near me that retrofits a bigger battery for a Nissan Leaf. But to be honest, I think it is just your range anxiety making you think that you will need a bigger battery. Come on, for every day drives even the standard 200 mile one is plenty.

Very curious about the garage... and do their projects hold up over time?

 

[St00k]

When I was considering switching dealers to a mainland dealer I started wondering how I was going to get the Mach E from Central Oregon (where we have investment property) to Oakland for shipment to Hawaii. I started looking at EA (primarily) and found DC fast charge stations all along I-5, usually every 70 miles or so. Recharging and range is quickly become a non-issue during longer road trips. The real issue is how you're going to occupy your time at the 17 Walmart and Target stops you make while waiting on 80% or so.

A journalist I know did this with a Taycan and posted some hilarious pics from Walmart

 

[micha]

Renault had a very limited program for upgrading the rented battery of the zoe, so you could update your battery from the original 22kwh to 40kwh. But only for a short time, it was the rumor that because of battery shortage they was no longer interested in doing this.

But i think the Zoe is a good example for how technology improved, the Zoe started 8 years ago with a 22kwh battery, now you get a 50kwh battery for nearly the same price and the battery is in the same box!
So they did not only double the capacity, the did it in the same form factor.

I think future EV will be in the range of 250 to 350 miles, the battery will shrink in size and weight and because of that doing EV will be even cheaper than today.
My Ioniq only has a range of 125miles and i just come back from a 2000miles trip through Europe!

Most people not owning an EV, compare charging an EV with filling up gas to an ICE.
But charging an EV is more like charging a cellphone, imagine you had to go to a special place once a week to charge there your phone for 10 minutes. i charge my car at home, there is nothing more convenient than that.

What i would love is the possibility to have an extension battery you can rent for road trips, you could plug in under the car, then for daily use 200miles are more than sufficient.

 

[Diogenes]

Most people not owning an EV, compare charging an EV with filling up gas to an ICE.
But charging an EV is more like charging a cellphone, imagine you had to go to a special place once a week to charge there your phone for 10 minutes. i charge my car at home, there is nothing more convenient than that.

This is the math that most people don't get. A simplified analysis here...

Driving to a petrol station and filling up is say ~10 min once a week for a total of 8:40Hrs/year... Say ~8:00Hrs.
Plugging in to charge 1x/week is like 10 seconds but say 1 min or 0:52 Hrs/year... Say 1:00Hr.

The ~7:00 Hr difference is 14 trips a year where ~30 min charging is required during each trip.

Again, a simple analysis but the net is that the total time spent in filling up isn't really a concern. So the only valid concern is that the charging infrastructure isn't at a point yet to make up for poor/no planning. That's going to change rapidly though.

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

A lot of us on the various Mach-e Forums are going to be first time EV owners (I'm driving a Toyota Tacoma atm). That means much of what the more experienced BEV owners and plug-in hybrid owners already know and understand is foreign to us. While I intellectually know the realities of charging and have no qualms about keeping my V6 Tacoma at 1/4 tank or less for a long period of time, i don't have that foundation of knowledge to develop a comfort level around BEV charge status. That will come of course, just as I know where to I need to fill the pickup on a trip to the volcano and back, I'll soon know when (or if) I need to swing by the HELCO/GreenLots DC fast charger in Hilo.

 

[MachDrive]

This is the math that most people don't get. A simplified analysis here...

Driving to a petrol station and filling up is say ~10 min once a week for a total of 8:40Hrs/year... Say ~8:00Hrs.
Plugging in to charge 1x/week is like 10 seconds but say 1 min or 0:52 Hrs/year... Say 1:00Hr.

The ~7:00 Hr difference is 14 trips a year where ~30 min charging is required during each trip.

Again, a simple analysis but the net is that the total time spent in filling up isn't really a concern. So the only valid concern is that the charging infrastructure isn't at a point yet to make up for poor/no planning. That's going to change rapidly though.

I did a similar comparison.

My round trip to work is 38 miles, 5 days a week = 190 miles. The MMe ER/AWD Ford EPA estimated range is 270. So, my regular usage charging pattern would only be once a week overnight full charge. Or maybe two times a week 80% top-off.

I could safely make my trips to Washington DC (233 miles, 4 times a year) on one full charge. I would probably stop off along the way and give it a 15 minute shot-in-the-arm. Darn range anxiety.

To Savanah, GA, (once a year) a little more complicated: 4 stops ~35 min each, compared to 2 fill ups for my old Edge, And one for my Fusion Hybrid.

So, while it would be nice to have more range, is it worth the big expense of replacing batteries just for my once a year use-case? Probably not. To extend the life of the vehicle (and resale) maybe.

 

[Ajmartineau]

To upgrade the MME like they are doing with the old Leafs, you will have to use the exact same number of battery cells that are significantly more energy-dense but are physically the same size (or smaller) while retaining the same voltage as the OEM cells. Any differences would create problems with the vehicle's systems. I also suspect there would be more than a few issues to solve with upgrading from a 75kWh pack to a 98kWh pack. IMO, I'm just an idiot with a keyboard.

 

[Diogenes]

In a large battery array, there has to be protection that isolates each battery in the event of damage or a short so 1 bad cell doesn't take the whole array down or worse, result in a fire. OR-ing diodes or FETs are commonly used for multiple power sources. Also, while the voltage rating is the same for the cells, they are not all at the same voltage all of the time.

The net is that it doesn't have the same number of cells and doesn't necessarily have be the same voltage rating (replacement could have a higher rating).

This is not to say that upgrading/replacing is easy or cost effective. I would not purchase the MME with the thought of replacing the batteries in the future.

 

[Tye]

Thanks everyone for the feedback! This is my first EV and my excitement and anxiety has taken over. After reading the comments, I’m at ease now with my current battery ER AWD 270ish and the charging station network progress

 

[guyofthesky]

Thanks everyone for the feedback! This is my first EV and my excitement and anxiety has taken over. After reading the comments, I’m at ease now with my current battery ER AWD 270ish and the charging station network progress

You will love driving an EV. Have fun!

I do think that buying the bigger battery is smart, if or no other reason, resale value.

As the years go by, and EVs have longer range, the ones purchased today with short range will look very short. But the ones purchased today with longer range will still be "okay" in five years.