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Discussion Starter #1
When compared to Mach E, Tesla Model Y specifications come close, so far. While we wait for more official Mach E specs, here where it'll have to compete:

Tesla Model Y Specifications

PowertrainRWDRWDAWDPerformance
BatteryStandard RangeLong Range
Base price (US market)$39,000$48,000$52,000$61,000
RangeEPA:
230 miles (370 km)[18]
WLTP:
390 km
242 mi
EPA:
300 miles (483 km)[18]
WLTP:
540 km
336 mi
EPA:
280 miles (451 km)[18]
WLTP:
505 km
314 mi
EPA:
280 miles (451 km)[18]
WLTP:
480 km
298 mi
Acceleration0–60 mph (0–97 km/h)
5.9 seconds advertised
0–60 mph (0–97 km/h)
5.5 seconds advertised
0–60 mph (0–97 km/h)
4.8 seconds advertised
0–60 mph (0–97 km/h)
3.5 seconds advertised
Top Speed120 mph (193 km/h)130 mph (209 km/h)135 mph (217 km/h)150 mph (241 km/h)
US Projected DeliveriesSpring 2021Fall 2020
Drag coefficient0.23
Luggage66 cu ft (1,869 L) max volume
 

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Based on the rumored specs of the Mach E, Ford is setting it up very nicely against Tesla and the Model Y.

Price: $40,000
Battery: 100-kWh
Range: EPA estimated 300 miles (482 km)
0-60 time: Under 3.5 seconds
 

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Tesla Model Y real-world range was put to work in this 1,000 mile trip.

I'm curious to see how the MME will compare.

"This is the second 1000 mile trip to Ohio to get my daughter. Didn't go as planned because of the weather. Light weight wheels from Signature Wheel didn't make a difference in the range which is a good thing."
 

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Tesla Model Y real-world range was put to work in this 1,000 mile trip.

I'm curious to see how the MME will compare.

"This is the second 1000 mile trip to Ohio to get my daughter. Didn't go as planned because of the weather. Light weight wheels from Signature Wheel didn't make a difference in the range which is a good thing."
Really interesting video, especially with the aftermarket wheels not really affecting the range. I'm looking forward to the Mach-E real world range tests as well.
 

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Now that many of us, myself included, have converted our reservations to orders, I thought it might be interesting to do a comparison of the long range AWD Model Y with the MachE First Edition. The First Edition is configured almost identically to the Model Y.

As of now leases are not available for the Model Y and there is a confusion as to whether the APR under the “Ford Option Plan” will be .9% or 5%. So, this comparison will assume buying and keeping each for 3 years and driving 10,500 miles per year.

Cost:

Both the Model Y and the MachE will be sold at MSRP without discounts:
  • Model Y $54,190 including destination charge
  • First Edition $60,400 less Federal tax credit of $7,500, $52,900
In considering the cost, you must also consider the car’s value after 3 years:
  • All Teslas have held their value well. They are about 60% of MSRP after 3 years. There is no reason to believe the Model Y will be different. But to be conservative, let’s assume 55% instead of 60%. Value at the end of 3 years, $29,800.
  • Ford products traditionally have not held their value well. It quite common to see after 3 years that Fords have retained between 40% and 45% of their MSRP. Let us assume 45% for the MachE. Value at the end of 3 years $27,180.
Cost of Model Y: $54,190 less $29,800, $24,390

Cost of First Edition: $52,900 less $27,170, $25,720

Styling:

While styling is purely subjective, to my eye the MachE is a far more handsome car both exterior and interior. I prefer the second screen in front of the steering wheel and the knob for certain functions.

Technology:

I think it is safe to say that at best Ford is playing catch up: Ford at a minimum is 3 to 5 years behind Tesla.

For example, take the battery of Model Y: 75 KW and a range of 316 miles vs. the First Edition: 88 KW and a range of 270 miles. The Tesla battery is 15% smaller yet produces 17% more range which makes it almost 30% more efficient. In the real world, that makes charging times almost 30% faster in the Model Y vs. First Edition.

The Model Y uses a heat pump for both AC and heating. The Model Y has proven over the air updates.

Driving experience:-

To date, all we have are reports of the driving experience of the Model Y: In the standard form most reviews have been excellent. In the performance model, acceleration has been outstanding, but ride has suffered due to the larger wheels.

The Model Y is faster than the First Edition.

We have to wait to see how the First Edition compares, but the Model Y has set the bar quite high.

Quality of Build and replacement parts:

No reason to dwell on this. The lack of build quality of all Tesla, including the Model Y has been well documented as well as the time wait for replacement parts.

Short of being a Fiat, the build quality of the First Edition must be better.

Ordering, dealership experience:

I have been in Tesla stores and the employees have been able to answer all my questions. I have called Tesla and again the person on the phone has been knowledgeable.

With Ford, my experience has been the opposite: When I called the Mustang hotline to inquire whether with the Ford Option Plan the APR would be .9% or 5%, the answer was that since I converted my reservation to an order, all further inquires must be directed to the dealer.

When I contacted my dealer, they did not even know of the Ford Option Plan.

With only 20,000 MachE allotted to the US, and a large portion of those going to California, I would not expect much effort on the part of my local dealer here on Long Island: there will just not be enough MachE to move the needle at your local dealership. In all probability you will know more about the MachE than your local dealer.
 

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@JTK44 - it will be interesting to revisit this once the final EPA numbers are out. and in-depth reviews are done with production vehicles.
 

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.......
While styling is purely subjective, to my eye the MachE is a far more handsome car both exterior and interior. I prefer the second screen in front of the steering wheel and the knob for certain functions.
.............
For example, take the battery of Model Y: 75 KW and a range of 316 miles vs. the First Edition: 88 KW and a range of 270 miles. The Tesla battery is 15% smaller yet produces 17% more range which makes it almost 30% more efficient. In the real world, that makes charging times almost 30% faster in the Model Y vs. First Edition.
.......
I'm on the fence between buying a Model Y or the Mach-E, and am on forums for both, gathering as much information as I can. I certainly agree that the Mach-E is a very good looking car. I also suspect it will be a better built auto as well. The horror stories of poor quality control at Tesla (at least for their MY) of the cars they are turning out is a real cause for concern.

I've also noted that more than a couple of MY owners are reporting considerably less range seen when driving their MYs. 250~270 miles seems to be the report coming back from LR MY owners (supposed to be over 300 miles range).

The purpose my wife and I wish to put our long range model EV (we already own a Bolt 2019 Premier~Nice little car, short legs for serious distances and long charge times...) is for a back and forth auto, Tucson area to Cape Cod, twice a year. So, we need what both the Mach-E and the MY have:

  • Semi-autonomous driving capabilities
  • Decent charge times as DCFC stations
  • A goodly size SUV type vehicle
The decision will be a tough one. I'm waiting on seeing if the build quality of the MY improves. If it does not, I'll certainly be opting for the Mach-E, although that will put another year between us wanting to buy and actually buying the car.

Rich
 

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Just saw this article: Plus Tesla just dropped the price of the long range AWD Model Y by $3,000 to $49,900. That makes the Model Y cheaper than the MachE even taking inot account the Federal Tax credit of $7,500.

see: First picture of Tesla Model Y and Ford Mustang Mach-E side by side - Electrek
Interesting.
As an example, my Mach-E ER/AWD premium MSRP is $58,340.
  • Subtract $7500 (i will get full fed credit, so my down payment will be 7500 total) = $50,840.
  • Subtract X price net discount of 872 = 49,958.
This makes my out-the-door purchase price just about equal to the new Tesla price.

And here is the asterisk * if Ford Credit keeps finance rates low and Ford still offers the Options $2500 incentive, it may help the payment be more in line with a traditional lease. even better if they increase the residual up to at least 55% on the 3 year, and 45% on the 4 year.

We shall see.
 

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I do not disagree with you:

But here is the reality as I see it:

Teslas are a known quantity: they are committed to the Model Y. Tesla expects the Model Y to outsell the Model S, X and 3 combined. That would be about 200,000 units per year. Ford has committed to only 50,000 units this year and next of which only 20,000 will be coming to the US.

The Model Y has a longer range, charges faster and has more advanced technology. The MachE has better styling, will probably have better quality control, but has a shorter range, longer charging time and technology that is several years behind Tesla. Add to that growing pains during first year of production. The 2020 MachE will be "Beta" cars.

I have no intention of buying the First Edition: I intend to lease: the lease on the Model Y as compared to "Option Plan" on the MachE, even after giving consideration to the Federal Tax Credit of $7,500, will be between $200 and $300 less per month.

As I have posted the "Option Plan" monthly payments are not competitive with the lease payments of similarly priced vehicles.

Ford said that from the very first vehicle they intended to make a profit: But that has resulted in a car that is not competitively priced with the industry standard.

How is that going to work?
 

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I wish the 50k number was the minimum target, and they would have the opportunity to increase that limit.
the more cars sold, the more you can distribute the recoupment of the development costs. This would result in a lower cost per unit.
They may not be able to change the MSRP of the sale, but maybe offer an ‘introductory’ rebate program based on the newly projected sales.

keeping my fingers crossed.
 

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Fr
I wish the 50k number was the minimum target, and they would have the opportunity to increase that limit.
the more cars sold, the more you can distribute the recoupment of the development costs. This would result in a lower cost per unit.
They may not be able to change the MSRP of the sale, but maybe offer an ‘introductory’ rebate program based on the newly projected sales.

keeping my fingers crossed.
WOA!

You have just described all the reason to lease and not buy!

But the problem is that the Ford Option Plan has monthly payments that are not competitive with the lease payments on the Model Y.

Based on my experience with leasing two Ford Edge Sports, I was really excited about the First Edition when I placed my order in November.

Now we have the "Ford Option Plan", the range, 270 miles, the introduction of the Model Y, the reduction in the price of the Model Y - I am far less excited today than I was in November.

Things have really changed in 7 short months!


.
 

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