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Ford Mach E SUV vs Tesla Model Y

34K views 215 replies 22 participants last post by  Louv 
#1 ·
When compared to Mach E, Tesla Model Y specifications come close, so far. While we wait for more official Mach E specs, here where it'll have to compete:

Tesla Model Y Specifications

PowertrainRWDRWDAWDPerformance
BatteryStandard RangeLong Range
Base price (US market)$39,000$48,000$52,000$61,000
RangeEPA:
230 miles (370 km)[18]
WLTP:
390 km
242 mi
EPA:
300 miles (483 km)[18]
WLTP:
540 km
336 mi
EPA:
280 miles (451 km)[18]
WLTP:
505 km
314 mi
EPA:
280 miles (451 km)[18]
WLTP:
480 km
298 mi
Acceleration0–60 mph (0–97 km/h)
5.9 seconds advertised
0–60 mph (0–97 km/h)
5.5 seconds advertised
0–60 mph (0–97 km/h)
4.8 seconds advertised
0–60 mph (0–97 km/h)
3.5 seconds advertised
Top Speed120 mph (193 km/h)130 mph (209 km/h)135 mph (217 km/h)150 mph (241 km/h)
US Projected DeliveriesSpring 2021Fall 2020
Drag coefficient0.23
Luggage66 cu ft (1,869 L) max volume
 
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#57 ·
I loved the Y test drive I took. I would have bought one if the quality issues were not so rampant.
You actually forgot another problem (and it is not the panel gaps and QC that indeed horrible) - service problem. Good luck getting good service from Tesla - either customer support or technical. I am still waiting for my refund - 65 days past. The good news - after many calls, it seems my bank finally get a request from Tesla. Yesterday.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk
 
#68 ·
Tesla appears to be playing 'catch up' with the Mach E.
This is an excerpt from some potential Model 3 upgrades such as a revised Frunk (a drain maybe) new steering wheel and something already available on the MMe:
Regarding double glazing, this may very well be an attempt by Tesla to improve the Model 3’s sometimes criticized NVH characteristics. These double-layered side windows are common among larger luxury cars where they do help quiet down the cabin, although they’re usually optional; they only come standard on very expensive cars.
 
#69 ·
I've been reading about the upgrades. A step in the right direction. I actually really love Tesla's vehicles. I just know for myself, I could not deal with the fit and finish issues that the cars are coming off the line with. I know every car maker has a % of issues, but with Tesla it's almost guaranteed. Where I live in NorCal, Tesla is as common as Honda. Neighbors and friends own Teslas. They love their cars, but they deal with way too many issues for a car in the upper price range.
 
#70 ·
I'm so back and forth on a decision between a Model Y or a Mach E. I put a deposit down on a Mach E GT, knowing it will be late summer. Just not sure I want to wait that long. I feel like the other Mach E models aren't going to have that same acceleration feel as the Y did for me. I know it's only a second to 60, but.... Definitely waiting until Battery day to see what the hoopla is about and also would like to read some reviews of Mach E's - when should journalists get to test - late October/November?
 
#71 ·
Also looking forward to Battery Day. I think there will be a lot of surprises. Have you driven a Y? If you go for a Y, just make sure on delivery day to inspect the car closely and refuse to take delivery if there is anything glaringly wrong. I have friends with the Y and like I said above, I love the car. If you can get one without defects you'll be happy with it.
 
#78 ·
#79 ·
'Be careful about the gloating about Model Y production problems. Are you absolutely sure that Ford won't be like any other automaker with early production problems. We haven't even seen a production Mach-E yet. Model Y was introduced into the Covid mess, and newest deliveries are showing substantial improvement. Tesla has also been very aggressive in introducing production changes on the fly. Look at the changes being introduced by the new giant castings. It appears that the Berlin Model Ys will feature the new 4680 battery with the integrated central structure, followed by Texas, Fremont and Shanghai. Eastern US deliveries from Texas may have the Berlin model by next fall.

I plan to wait and see. Mach-E, Model Y, and Audi Q4 etron are still on my list for a next fall purchase. I need a dual motor AWD long range under $55,000 for NJ $5,000 rebate. Audi and Ford still have the Federal tax credit. With the $7,500, it looks like the Mach-E will be the best price unless Tesla lowers its price again.
 
#80 ·
I decided that I didn't want to wait any longer and ordered a Y a couple of weeks ago - being built this week. My guess is that Ford will do OK production wise - my last three Fords (Raptor, and two Explorers) have/did not ever have a service issue. The 2020 Explorer being a new model as well (purchased a year ago). But Sync 3 hasn't been that great in any of them. So, I think Ford will have growing pains with Sync 4 - Tesla seems way ahead in that department. Maybe in a couple of years I come back to look at a Ford EV. For now, wanted to try something totally new for me.
 
#89 ·
Is Munro correct: make a car 95% correct and then get feedback to correct the 5%? I do not think so.
Munro is wrong. A 95% correct car is called an Alpha build, not ready for production. I’m surprised he would make such a statement.

You make a car to function 100% as designed. Customer feedback helps the car evolve into something more desirable and useful to buyers.

Complaints about glass roofs flying off are not the same feedback as “The shifter should be a little further from the steering wheel so I don’t hit it by accident.” The first should trigger the respose “holy mackerel! Stop the line and investigate right now!” The second would elicit the response “thats a good point, maybe we should consider on the next model refresh “

Right now they are selling every car that they can build in Fremont.
They shouldn’t be selling Model Y’s at all from Fremont. Stop the line and figure out your issues. The ones you see could be masking a greater problem.
If you can’t align the body-panels or get the glass roof to mount right, your main body-frame may not be square, or you spec’d your stampings wrong and your glass is warped.

Something is seriously wrong. Take a look Tesla and be transparent about it.

A lot of mistakes along the way, but don't write off what they have learned and how fast they respond.
You’ve missed my point. My argument has nothing to do with diminishing the innovations or technologies from Telsa. Tesla is making mistakes that shouldn’t be made, there are decades of data and example to learn from.

If all I’ve written has failed to make my point, then there is nothing more to be said.

Before I am written off as a Telsa hater and get attacked by the fan-base, let me just add I do not hate the company Tesla. In fact, I am in the process of buying a Tesla SolarRoof with PowerWalls. I am just shocked that Their Model 3 and Y cars can be so advanced on one hand, yet so inferior on the other. It is baffling to me.
 
#88 ·
JTK44's link says it all. The Fremont paint shop IS a problem and new shop is in the works as in Berlin, Shanghai, and the upcoming Texas plant. Right now they are selling every car that they can build in Fremont. They'll figure how to do the upgrade just as they have with integrating the new castings and removing robots. A lot of mistakes along the way, but don't write off what they have learned and how fast they respond.
 
#106 ·
I'm sure the Mach-E will be successful, its a very attractive car. The only hold up will be production. 2021 looks like a watershed year for EVs with the number of new entrants that are BETTER cars than their ICE competition. Elon Musk welcomes these cars, not as competition for his products, but as complementary competition against ICE cars in a long term goal of electrification. I think he's right and EVs are on a breakthrough path.
 
#108 ·
Tesla will not lose market share: Expect further price reductions in the US when the MME is introduced:

"Now a new report from Tianfeng Securities is predicting Tesla will lower the price of the Model Y in China when it starts production and deliveries in the country, according to the website Seek Device.

Tianfeng is forecasting a price of 275,000 yuan ($41,000) vs. the current price of $49,990 in the U.S."

see: https://www.yahoo.com/news/china-made-tesla-model-y-153547125.html
 
#111 ·
How many? By the end of this year over a million...
I wonder if Tesla decided to produce a car with normal build quality:

  • How much would Tesla have to slow down their production line to eliminate these quality control issues?
  • Could they raise prices enough to offset the loss of volume?
  • Today the weight is 6 to 8 weeks. If they slowed production down to eliminate these quality control issues would the wait go to 3 to 4 months and would people be willing to wait that long?
Is the average Tesla buyer a "techie" who is used to getting computers that are constantly being upgraded or an auto guy. I think the former and not the latter and that is why Tesla can get away with these quality control issues.

.
 
#113 ·
A million MM Es? Perhaps you misread the question? I asked the question How many MM E owners would accept vehicles with problems similar to the Tesla's, and since it was a hypothetical it was also rhetorical. I 'sort of' understood when Tesla was for all intents and purposes the 'only show in town' but with more and more potential competition I simply do not understand the mindset that "it's getting better", (keeping in mind that I don't understand many many things). Let me state for the record that I have no stake in how anyone chooses to spend their money (Yugo owners?) and I understand that Musk must produce numbers if the automobile arm of his companies is to survive but after eight years I can't grasp that 'fit and finish' is still an issue. IJMO/ICBW
 
#114 ·
While you enjoy bashing Tesla, where issues have improved, don't be smug about legacy OEM quality; brake failure, fit and finish of C8 Corvette; Ford eco-boost engine failures; Chevy Bolt battery fires; Polestar 2 total shutdowns, other computer glitches and rattles; etc., etc. All companies have issues with new models. Tesla is doing just fine on the "survive" issue with exponential growth. It's ICE Manufacturers that should worry. There is a paradigm shift now where up coming new cars are joining Tesla in being better cars than their ICE counterparts at competitive pricing. The very attractive Mach-E is a good start, but Ford has a long way to go.

I have no doubt that next fall after a Covid hiatus, when I make a final choice between Model Y. Mach-E, or Q4 Etron, I'll be able to make the choice on the merits of each car with about equal risk of problems on the delivered car.
 
#118 ·
Again, calling out Tesla on quality is not bashing. It is NOT okay for them to deliver vehicles to customers the way they are. And we have all called out Ford and others for their issues, or have you not read any of the many posts regarding marketing, dealer training, etc?

I am of the mindset: We keep score in sports. There are winners and losers. You don’t get a trophy just for participation. And if you didn’t give something your all? There is no pat on the back saying “good job, its okay you just did mediocre”.
Heck No, if you failed, practice more and do better. Learn from your mistakes and stop making them. You will be better-off for it in the long run.

I close by saying: if Ford FUBARs anything with the MMe, there is not one person on this forum that will be kind to Ford. We are equal opportunity critics.
 
#115 ·
Just found this post on the Audi Etron forum: It raises a point I never thought of and a possible explanation for Tesla obsession with quantity over quality:

"Unfortunately, there is a disincentive for Tesla to focus on quality. The company is actually a Financial Energy Credit company. It has never turned a profit based on car sales. The cars are sold at a loss. Any profit has been due to the selling of energy credits it receives for being an all EV company. The number of credits it receives is based on the volume of cars it sells. Other car companies buy these credits to off set emission penalties. As long as people are willing to deal with terrible quality, Tesla will focus on churning out as many cars as it can, regardless of quality. "
 
#117 ·
Yes, if there Energy Credits dry up, then they will have an income shortage. Without these credits, They wouldn’t have any profit in any quarter of their existence.

That strategy may backfire, once they saturate the consumer-base willing to accept poor quality at such an expensive price-point.

Tesla also rushing to finish their other factories to beat all the upcoming competition to market. There soon will be too many affordable EVs scrounging for EU customers. In the US, its an uphill battle against ICE, but for the rest of the world? Act now or go home.
 
#129 ·
The updated warranty terms from Tesla is now in line with the rest if the industry for certified vehicles. The practice is to honor the balance of the original warranty, or give you a limited extended warranty on used vehicles outside the original warranty window. For non-certified vehicles (sold “AS-IS”), there are local laws that can help protect you.

Fact is, if Tesla used car sales are doing well, why should they incur the extra cost if they don’t have to? Stinks for the consumer, though.
 
#130 ·
The updated warranty terms from Tesla is now in line with the rest if the industry for certified vehicles. The practice is to honor the balance of the original warranty, or give you a limited extended warranty on used vehicles outside the original warranty window. For non-certified vehicles (sold “AS-IS”), there are local laws that can help protect you.

Fact is, if Tesla used car sales are doing well, why should they incur the extra cost if they don’t have to? Stinks for the consumer, though.
And, Ford is not likely to do any better with their EVs...
 
#137 ·
#138 ·
Every time I think of the Model Y vs. the MME another story about Tesla appears.
Good thing: Tesla acknowledging it. Excellent first step. They need to take ownership of some other design flaws and issues, then make appropriate remedies. Don’t get me wrong, Tesla does issue TSB and recalls now and then.

Bad thing: Tesla fanaticals who harassed all those coming forward as liers, haters, or FUD spreaders won’t acknowledge it. Nor will they go back and apologize for the way they treated these individuals.

As a customer affected by voluntary recalls and TSBs of Ford in the past, I don’t have the attitude of ‘great another problem’, but one of ‘they are still looking out for me, even after I bought the car.’

I recommend owners of ANY vehicle from ANY manufacturer should use this link: USDOT NHTSA - Safety Issues and Recalls Database , it only includes TSBs that are deemed ‘safety related’, because that is all that is required by law to release.

People can also submit an issue for review. I recommend anyone with a problem with their vehicle (again, any manufacturer) that is concerning file a complaint with the NHTSA. It is not a bad thing to say there is an issue, it just helps every other owner of the same car you have get help.

I am surprised I don't see a complaint about the Model Y glass roof flying off, to me that should prompt the owner to file a report. he did file a police report because he was worried the debris would cause an accident. Go figure.
 
#140 ·
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