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I live in snow country, driving a Focus RS. I discovered that deep snow tears the front spoiler off. The solution in deep snow? Drive in reverse until you get to a plowed street.
A friend of mine got the front bumper cover pulled off his Audi going in reverse through heavy snow. The corner by the wheel-well got too much drag and it literally just popped off. It was one of the sedans, not an SUV.

I may not drive the MMe through more than a few inches of snow until sometime next winter. i’ll wait to see what everyone else experienced. Yes, I’m chicken. :)
 

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I've used Goodyear Ultra Grip Ice WRT's on my Escape and I haven't had any complaints. As for wheels, I just get steelies, no need to get too fancy.
Anybody know if Ford is going to offer a winter wheel/tire package? Especially on the GT performance that comes with summers?
 

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Anybody know if Ford is going to offer a winter wheel/tire package? Especially on the GT performance that comes with summers?
Considering the loss of range in the winter, do you even want to be driving the MME in snow and ice?
 

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Considering the loss of range in the winter, do you even want to be driving the MME in snow and ice?
???

Worst case winter range in the lowest range spec, even with Winter tires is going to be at least 2x (probably 3-4x) almost all people drive in a day. So if they must drive in the ice and snow, why would they not?

Sent from my LM-G710 using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter #27
Considering the loss of range in the winter, do you even want to be driving the MME in snow and ice?
Absolutely. Why not? Range is reduced but for my needs I only need to charge at home and on rare cases have to use DC fast charger. ICE cars are also less efficient in winter by about 15%.
 

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ICE cars are also less efficient in winter by about 15%.
Just returned from Vermont: Temps in the teens and low 20's. I drive a Mercedes E450 (V6 twin turbo)

MPG: 32

Same trip in summer:

MPG: 32

Fact: In winter air is denser and with denser air you get better efficiency out of an ICE. This offsets any winter blending of fuel.

Key point to remember: Keep your tires inflated to their proper setting. Most people do not maintain proper air pressure in their tires in the winter. A pressure of 35 psi in the summer at 70/80 degrees, if air is not added, will be between 27/28 when temps fall to the teens.

I always maintain the proper pressure: I have an excellent air compressor and accurate tire gauge.

If you maintain your tire pressure you will get, as I do, virtually the same mpg in winter as in summer. Of course if you use winter tires, range will decrease - but that is because of the tires not the temperature.

I have concluded, regardless of whether it is SR, LR or LR AWD MME, you will lose 10% of range at highway speeds and another 25% to 30% when temps go below freezing. That is just a fact of all EV's - not just the MME.

That means the SR range of 230 miles, less 10%, 210 miles, less 30% 140 miles, and if you recharge at 30 miles left, the effective range is 110.

The AWD LR has a range of 270 miles, less 10%, 245 miles, less 30% 170 miles and if you recharge with 30 miles left, the effective range is 140 miles.

IMO, until there is a robust supercharging network in place, for winter driving the MME is limited to local driving, commuting and short trips - certainly not the trip I take to Vermont which is 260 miles each way!

For that I will have to continue to use an ICE.
 

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Discussion Starter #29
Just returned from Vermont: Temps in the teens and low 20's. I drive a Mercedes E450 (V6 twin turbo)

MPG: 32

Same trip in summer:

MPG: 32

Fact: In winter air is denser and with denser air you get better efficiency out of an ICE. This offsets any winter blending of fuel.

Key point to remember: Keep your tires inflated to their proper setting. Most people do not maintain proper air pressure in their tires in the winter. A pressure of 35 psi in the summer at 70/80 degrees, if air is not added, will be between 27/28 when temps fall to the teens.

I always maintain the proper pressure: I have an excellent air compressor and accurate tire gauge.

If you maintain your tire pressure you will get, as I do, virtually the same mpg in winter as in summer. Of course if you use winter tires, range will decrease - but that is because of the tires not the temperature.

I have concluded, regardless of whether it is SR, LR or LR AWD MME, you will lose 10% of range at highway speeds and another 25% to 30% when temps go below freezing. That is just a fact of all EV's - not just the MME.

That means the SR range of 230 miles, less 10%, 210 miles, less 30% 140 miles, and if you recharge at 30 miles left, the effective range is 110.

The AWD LR has a range of 270 miles, less 10%, 245 miles, less 30% 170 miles and if you recharge with 30 miles left, the effective range is 140 miles.

IMO, until there is a robust supercharging network in place, for winter driving the MME is limited to local driving, commuting and short trips - certainly not the trip I take to Vermont which is 260 miles each way!

For that I will have to continue to use an ICE.
For 3 years I have driven a Chevy Bolt. Not a luxury car but a good intro to EV. Living in Ontario Canada, 95% of our driving falls within the battery range, even in winter. For those times we need to drive longer distance in winter, it requires DC fast charging for 30 to 40 min. Which is the same amount of time we would normally stop for a break.

Living with an EV has required minor change in habits. After a few months, you will ask why you were not in an EV sooner!

We look forward to the larger Mustang Mach-E first edition.
 

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For those times we need to drive longer distance in winter, it requires DC fast charging for 30 to 40 min. Which is the same amount of time we would normally stop for a break.

Living with an EV has required minor change in habits. After a few months, you will ask why you were not in an EV sooner!

We look forward to the larger Mustang Mach-E first edition.
Trip to Vermont: I do this 10 times during the ski season.

ICE:

254 miles: driving time 4 hours 5 minutes: Two quick bathroom breaks at rest stops: 10 minutes; total elapsed time 4: hours 15 minutes. Arrive with more than 1/2 a tank of gas.

MME LR AWD

Drive 140 miles: stop to recharge 80%: 40 minutes. This gives 216 miles: less 10%, 190 miles, less 30% 133 miles. Stop again to get 80% charge, 40 minutes. Total elapsed time, 5 hours and 25 minutes.

The elapsed time in the MME is like driving the ICE at 50 mph!

Yes you can do it, but who wants to turn a 4 hour trip into a 5 hour trip!

PS: Just checked for EA charging stations along the I-95/I-91 corridor between New Haven CT and Vermont: There are none!

So I could not even use the MME unless I wanted to "piggy back" onto the Tesla L2 charging stations.
 

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If you maintain your tire pressure you will get, as I do, virtually the same mpg in winter as in summer.
You won't in an EV.

You should expect about a 30% range loss in cold, wet driving conditions especially if freeway driving over 60 mph is part of the trip. The parasitic heat loss in the EV is the main culprit but cold also lowers battery capacity and wet lowers driving efficiency as does speed over 60 mph.

If you have long winter runs in your normal driving pattern (going skiing for example), you need to look at the route carefully, look at the fast DC charging options on the route to see if it is going to work for you.

I have concluded, regardless of whether it is SR, LR or LR AWD MME, you will lose 10% of range at highway speeds and another 25% to 30% when temps go below freezing.
That's a bit conservative, the 30% range loss will include the discharge buffer of 10%. OK being conservative as there could be traffic jams or other issues that you will need that 10%.

Writing to EA, writing to your Congressmen to push the 500,000 fast DC public charging stations legislation, writing to state and local governments and to businesses that you personally would use and that would benefit from installing chargers.

We should see a big build out over next four years.
 

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You won't in an EV.

You should expect about a 30% range loss in cold, wet driving conditions especially if freeway driving over 60 mph is part of the trip. The parasitic heat loss in the EV is the main culprit but cold also lowers battery capacity and wet lowers driving efficiency as does speed over 60 mph.

If you have long winter runs in your normal driving pattern (going skiing for example), you need to look at the route carefully, look at the fast DC charging options on the route to see if it is going to work for you.
EV"s I agree:

See my post #28 above where I calculated the range for SR and LR AWD assuming 10% loss in range driving on interstates and loss of range, 25% to 30% when temperatures below freezing.

With regard to

"you need to look at the route carefully"
see my post #30 in checking EA supercharging stations between New Haven, CT and Vermont, there aren't any. Zero none!

Without supercharging stations you cannot use the MME to go skiing in Vermont.

POI: Tesla is only slightly better with three supercharging stations between Hartford and Battleboro, VT. There are many L2, destination charging stations, assuming you make it to them and have several hours to wait!
 

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see my post #30 in checking EA supercharging stations between New Haven, CT and Vermont, there aren't any. Zero none!
In planning for MachE, I've found I have to actually visit the sites. I'll use the Tesla Chademo adapter. Also look at all charging via Plugshare. A 50kW charger like an EVgo that has Chademo and CCS will work.

Had an Audi e-Tron towing a, to me, big travel trailer pull in and start charging at local EVgo.
 

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Just returned from Vermont: Temps in the teens and low 20's. I drive a Mercedes E450 (V6 twin turbo)

MPG: 32

Same trip in summer:

MPG: 32

Fact: In winter air is denser and with denser air you get better efficiency out of an ICE. This offsets any winter blending of fuel.

Key point to remember: Keep your tires inflated to their proper setting. Most people do not maintain proper air pressure in their tires in the winter. A pressure of 35 psi in the summer at 70/80 degrees, if air is not added, will be between 27/28 when temps fall to the teens.

I always maintain the proper pressure: I have an excellent air compressor and accurate tire gauge.

If you maintain your tire pressure you will get, as I do, virtually the same mpg in winter as in summer. Of course if you use winter tires, range will decrease - but that is because of the tires not the temperature.

I have concluded, regardless of whether it is SR, LR or LR AWD MME, you will lose 10% of range at highway speeds and another 25% to 30% when temps go below freezing. That is just a fact of all EV's - not just the MME.

That means the SR range of 230 miles, less 10%, 210 miles, less 30% 140 miles, and if you recharge at 30 miles left, the effective range is 110.

The AWD LR has a range of 270 miles, less 10%, 245 miles, less 30% 170 miles and if you recharge with 30 miles left, the effective range is 140 miles.

IMO, until there is a robust supercharging network in place, for winter driving the MME is limited to local driving, commuting and short trips - certainly not the trip I take to Vermont which is 260 miles each way!

For that I will have to continue to use an ICE.
Some observations:
  • The BEV + ICE vehicle is going to be the predominant combination for most families who own an EV.
  • Not sure where in VT you travel to but for me, the sparse/non-existent Tesla Supercharger network in central VT (where I mostly go skiing) doesn't really provide any sort of an advantage.
  • For many road trips, it's a cost savings/financial benefit to rent a vehicle. Even with only ICE vehicles, I'll rent cars for road trips depending on the expected miles. Net, for slight inconvenience a few times/year (pick up/drop off), those with a BEV as the only vehicle, rentals are a viable option for longer road trips.
That all said, I think the BEV as only car issue is for apartment/condo/townhouse dwellers who do not have off street parking with charging facilities. They don't necessarily want to be paying 20,30, even 40 cents per kilowatt hour all the time either. If large cities start installing charging bays on the street (lamp posts and such), reserve them for EVs, and roll in the utility/parking charges at an attractive rate for residents, I think it may just incent these folks enough to accelerate EV adoption.
 

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In planning for MachE, I've found I have to actually visit the sites. I'll use the Tesla Chademo adapter. Also look at all charging via Plugshare. A 50kW charger like an EVgo that has Chademo and CCS will work.

Had an Audi e-Tron towing a, to me, big travel trailer pull in and start charging at local EVgo.
From my post #30 where I posted:

"So I could not even use the MME unless I wanted to "piggy back" onto the Tesla L2 charging stations."

and my post #32:

"There are many L2, destination charging stations, assuming you make it to them and have several hours to wait! "


Back when I started to drive, we carried water as our radiators overheated. In the winter we carried blankets and wore heavy coats because car heaters were insufficient to keep us warm.

It Is now 2021: I have complete freedom in an ICE to go where and when I want to in complete comfort. My ice does not overheat in the summer and keeps me cool and in the winter it keeps me warm and comfortable. If I need fuel there are thousands of gas stations available.

Am my age, I do not plan to 'roll back the clock" and start planning trips on the location of charging stations and worse yet when I get there not finding them working!

The MME may be perfect for around town, commuting and short trips: but until there is a robust supercharging network in place, it is totally impractically for long trips beyond 150 miles especially in the winter.
 

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From my post #30 where I posted:

"So I could not even use the MME unless I wanted to "piggy back" onto the Tesla L2 charging stations."

and my post #32:

"There are many L2, destination charging stations, assuming you make it to them and have several hours to wait! "


Back when I started to drive, we carried water as our radiators overheated. In the winter we carried blankets and wore heavy coats because car heaters were insufficient to keep us warm.

It Is now 2021: I have complete freedom in an ICE to go where and when I want to in complete comfort. My ice does not overheat in the summer and keeps me cool and in the winter it keeps me warm and comfortable. If I need fuel there are thousands of gas stations available.

Am my age, I do not plan to 'roll back the clock" and start planning trips on the location of charging stations and worse yet when I get there not finding them working!

The MME may be perfect for around town, commuting and short trips: but until there is a robust supercharging network in place, it is totally impractically for long trips beyond 150 miles especially in the winter.
Curious... where do you go in VT where the Supercharger network makes a significant difference?
 

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Discussion Starter #39
From my post #30 where I posted:

"So I could not even use the MME unless I wanted to "piggy back" onto the Tesla L2 charging stations."

and my post #32:

"There are many L2, destination charging stations, assuming you make it to them and have several hours to wait! "


Back when I started to drive, we carried water as our radiators overheated. In the winter we carried blankets and wore heavy coats because car heaters were insufficient to keep us warm.

It Is now 2021: I have complete freedom in an ICE to go where and when I want to in complete comfort. My ice does not overheat in the summer and keeps me cool and in the winter it keeps me warm and comfortable. If I need fuel there are thousands of gas stations available.

Am my age, I do not plan to 'roll back the clock" and start planning trips on the location of charging stations and worse yet when I get there not finding them working!

The MME may be perfect for around town, commuting and short trips: but until there is a robust supercharging network in place, it is totally impractically for long trips beyond 150 miles especially in the winter.
My once or twice a month trip in my current Chevy Bolt round trip is 400km which in summer needs 10 min DC fast charge to end trip with 10% range and 30 min in winter. With the MME FE I Will not need any charging for summer or winter for this trip.
My longest road trip is 720km which requires 2 x 40 min DC fast charging stops with Chevy Bolt in summer. The MME FE will need 1 DC fast charge for 30 min for this trip. Not a big deal. I need the break to have something to eat and use washroom.

Ontario and Quebec have a good network of DC fast charging stations on the major roads I travel.
 

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Curious... where do you go in VT where the Supercharger network makes a significant difference?
Ludlow to ski Okemo.

Tesla has a supercharger in Brattleboro, 55 miles away. There are L2 charges at the mountain. The next closest Tesla supercharger station is Rutland, 40 miles then White River Junction, 55 miles.

When I went to EA map, the closet supercharging station is at Springfield, MA - 115 miles away. There is a L2 in Brattleboro and White River Junction. Nothing else.

So realistically, assume I somehow make it to Ludlow, I have to spend hours at the Tesla L2 charger in order to get back to Springfield, Mass EA supercharger.

Then what happens if the supercharger at Springfield is not operating or only at L2 output?

Again great for local, commuting, short trips but not long trips.

My wife says it sounds like the Mustang is a perfect third car!
 
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